M6 - unforeseeable catastrophic damage - BMW Forum - BimmerWerkz.com
M-Series (M1, M3, M5, M6) General M-Series Discussion - If it does not fit into a more specific M Category above, please place it in here. In addition, previously archived M-Series discussion is located in this section.

 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
#1 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 12:44 AM
n00b
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ronald Helmuth is on a distinguished road
(Thread Starter)
Angry M6 - unforeseeable catastrophic damage

I have a 2007 M6 convertible, which I acquired in December of last year. I have driven the car approximately 4200 miles. Unfortunately, I was involved in an incident traveling at about 5-7 mph in an underground parking garage. The car lurched into a concrete support column, making contact at the left front fender/bumper assembly, just in front of the wheel well. I do not really know what happened, but it felt like the car just lurched sideways as if a piece of suspension broke. I am curious whether anyone has had such an experience or know of any other M5/M6 owners who have.

The really troubling part of this is that initial repair estimates by my insurance carrier claims representatives with an assist from several top grade collision centers are in excess of $25,000! It seems that the minor impact, which was not even significant enough to trigger any airbag deployment, resulted in damage requiring frame straightening and complete suspension and steering replacement in addition to the body and other necessary parts. Moreover, in order to make these repairs, the engine/trans need to be pulled, as well as the complete dash assembly. So far, it has taken 10 days just to make a preliminary determination of the scope of repairs. The time to repair estimate is 20 workdays and climbing. Needless to say, no one at BMW told me that the nature of the car's construction was such that a 5 mph incident could result in this type of catastrophic damage to the car or this magnitude of repair cost. Further, I have been informed that this type of repair means that the car can never qualify for CPO status.

Nothing in any of the BMW produced M6 marketing materials I was provided or any of the M6 vehicle information provided with the car at the time of purchase would give me or any potential or actual purchaser of an M6 any inkling that such damage was a foreseeable result from an incident of such minor nature.

I believe that BMW should have disclosed this information to me before I purchased the car. Had I been advised of this risk, I would not have purchased the vehicle. That is why I am very interested in knowing if there are any others that have had a similar experience to mine, so that I can take that into consideration as I decide how to proceed. If so, please contact me directly on my cell phone 818.414.7552 - or at helmuthmalone@msn.com

Thank you for your consideration of the above.

Ronald Helmuth, Esq.
Ronald Helmuth is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
#2 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 08:52 AM
OMFG another one!?
 
witeshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Miami FL
Posts: 14,697
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
witeshark is just really nice witeshark is just really nice witeshark is just really nice witeshark is just really nice witeshark is just really nice
At a slow speed like that, structure straightening seems a bit much.

BMW

Sig by zeaq
witeshark is offline  
#3 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 09:34 AM
5th Gear Member
 
darkhorse737's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 1,494
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
darkhorse737 is on a distinguished road
Post

something is wrong. whoever you are talking to wants to stick you for big bucks... or maybe is waiting for you to give up on the car so they can take it over...

if you have detailed pics of the damage, upload them please. the boyz in this forum can assess it for you. we had a case recently where a fellow member in AUS crashed into a pole. It looked very bad in the pics, but it turned out to be fixable .

Last edited by darkhorse737; 07-17-2008 at 09:36 AM.
darkhorse737 is offline  
#4 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 07:20 PM
drz
Administrator
 
drz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Tee Ex
Posts: 12,129
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to drz Send a message via MSN to drz
Wow man. This is not good. Do the people who drafted this estimate agree on the impact speed? I don't want to be a jerk, but sometimes we do go faster than we think. Still, it sounds a but drastic to have to do frame straightening if you were going at such a low speed that it felt like only 5 mph or so.

I would ask the shop to show you the damage. Have them provide you with pictures and compare your car to a "good" reference unit.

It doesn't make any sense to me that the suspension and or steering need to be replaced. You did mention that it felt like a suspension component broke. Did any pf the shops see anything that correlates to that? Broken control arm, etc.?

Let me ask you this: is the car still driveable? Does it feel weird at all? Does it pull to the side, vibrate, etc.? You have electronic dampening, right?

These things aren't easy to diagnose remotely, but from my previous experiences, I am inclined to say that these people have seen you come in an M6 and figured the insurance company and you should have known what they were getting into, and are now trying to run up a large bill.

Best of luck.

I hope we can be of some help. The more we know, the more we can be of assistance.

- Daniel

drz is offline  
#5 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 07:53 PM
n00b
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ronald Helmuth is on a distinguished road
(Thread Starter)
please see my responses to your questions:

Wow man. This is not good. Do the people who drafted this estimate agree on the impact speed?

RESPONSE: 2 body shops, the BMW dealer, and my insurance company all agree that I was going something less than 10 mph, since the front bumper exploded on the driver side in front of the point of impact and no bags went off.

I don't want to be a jerk, but sometimes we do go faster than we think. Still, it sounds a but drastic to have to do frame straightening if you were going at such a low speed that it felt like only 5 mph or so.

I would ask the shop to show you the damage. Have them provide you with pictures and compare your car to a "good" reference unit.

RESPONSE: 2 body shops and the regional senior claims inspector for my insurance company all agree on the extend of the damage.

It doesn't make any sense to me that the suspension and or steering need to be replaced. You did mention that it felt like a suspension component broke. Did any pf the shops see anything that correlates to that? Broken control arm, etc.?

RESPONSE: my insurance company is sending an investigator to determine if there was a mechanical failure preceding the incident.

Let me ask you this: is the car still driveable? Does it feel weird at all? Does it pull to the side, vibrate, etc.? You have electronic dampening, right?

RESPONSE: The car is not driveable - the entire front passenger side suspension is broken, as is the steering system, including the steering gear.

These things aren't easy to diagnose remotely, but from my previous experiences, I am inclined to say that these people have seen you come in an M6 and figured the insurance company and you should have known what they were getting into, and are now trying to run up a large bill.

RESPONSE: Everyone at BMW, the insurance carrier and the two body shops is shocked at the bill, but all agree on the extent of the parts and labor required.
Ronald Helmuth is offline  
#6 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 10:03 PM
drz
Administrator
 
drz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Tee Ex
Posts: 12,129
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute drz has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to drz Send a message via MSN to drz
That your car underwent so much damage in such circumstances is appalling. I understand why you are so upset. I hope things work out in the best way possible for you. For what the car costs, you should expect good quality. I must remark that this is the first time I hear such new about a BMW after a fender-bender, but there is a first time for everything

Good luck.

drz is offline  
#7 (permalink) Old 07-18-2008, 01:35 AM
A NEW DAY RISES...
 
RoadsterMadness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 2,438
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of RoadsterMadness has much to be proud of
I too am shocked and feel terrible for you and what happened. This is the first instance I've heard of such a bad result on a minor collision in an ///M. That said, I have some additional thoughts:

1 - Unfortnately (and I feel wrongly) performance part companies are SLOW, EXPENSIVE and generally lousy in repairs, even minor ones on occasion. This is not fair or right, but it is common in the industry.

2 - It seems you are sniffing for a class action lawsuit and if there are others similarly situated you of course do what you feel you need to do. I very much hope though that you are not simply "sniffing around for a fee" and trawling the forums for a nice class to collect a fee upon as that would be MORE than unfortunate...I truly hope this is not the case and that you merely want to make things right, but the tone of your emails and responses reeks of a plaintiff's attorney lurking and most others on the enthusiast sites just wouldn't smell that to the extent that I do. Sorry, but the way you listed responses in your postings was just way too familiar to what I see nearly every day in my national practice.

If #2 above is simply an innocent attempt to get to the bottom of this issue, you have my sincerest apology. If not, I am much less happy with your posting. By all means hold BMW to task if they are treating you unfairly as you have every right to a quality product given it age, price and manufacturer. If your fact pattern is accurate you have much to be upset about and I wish you only luck in any endeavors you undertake - just be above board as everything does not a colorable lawsuit make.


2008 ///M5 with Eisenmann race exhaust "Athena"
2013 VOLKSWAGEN Tiguan 2L Turbo
RIP 2005 Dinan ///M3 S3-R+ Vert w/hardtop- 6-speed, DINAN SC - race kit, race headers, etc.
RIP 2002 Z3 Roadster 2.5i - VF Supercharged, 5-speed, Brembos etc.
Turkey ///M Car Fleet Commander
TINA FAN CLUB PRESIDENT
RoadsterMadness is offline  
#8 (permalink) Old 07-18-2008, 03:18 AM
Keep it Copacetic
 
///M Power's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St. Louis, MO ||| Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 9,481
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute ///M Power has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to ///M Power
An impact less than 10 mph requiring an entire rebuild of the suspension and steering column? I agree 100%.....wait...what is that you say? you mean it wasn't made of toothpicks?


1995 BMW M3 Turbo - Dakar/Black
///M Power is offline  
#9 (permalink) Old 07-18-2008, 07:33 AM
1st Gear Member
 
iamcreepingdeath's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 233
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
iamcreepingdeath is on a distinguished road
That car should be replaced by BMW, not only because under warranty, but insurance should fully cover that.

iamcreepingdeath is offline  
#10 (permalink) Old 07-22-2009, 09:45 AM
n00b
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 8
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Jubeski is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadsterMadness View Post
I too am shocked and feel terrible for you and what happened. This is the first instance I've heard of such a bad result on a minor collision in an ///M. That said, I have some additional thoughts:

1 - Unfortnately (and I feel wrongly) performance part companies are SLOW, EXPENSIVE and generally lousy in repairs, even minor ones on occasion. This is not fair or right, but it is common in the industry.

2 - It seems you are sniffing for a class action lawsuit and if there are others similarly situated you of course do what you feel you need to do. I very much hope though that you are not simply "sniffing around for a fee" and trawling the forums for a nice class to collect a fee upon as that would be MORE than unfortunate...I truly hope this is not the case and that you merely want to make things right, but the tone of your emails and responses reeks of a plaintiff's attorney lurking and most others on the enthusiast sites just wouldn't smell that to the extent that I do. Sorry, but the way you listed responses in your postings was just way too familiar to what I see nearly every day in my national practice.

If #2 above is simply an innocent attempt to get to the bottom of this issue, you have my sincerest apology. If not, I am much less happy with your posting. By all means hold BMW to task if they are treating you unfairly as you have every right to a quality product given it age, price and manufacturer. If your fact pattern is accurate you have much to be upset about and I wish you only luck in any endeavors you undertake - just be above board as everything does not a colorable lawsuit make.
Jubeski is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  BMW Forum - BimmerWerkz.com > BMW Model Specific Forums > M-Series (M1, M3, M5, M6)


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Damage to flywheel 4inPWR 3-Series (E36) 3 09-23-2007 01:11 PM
325i Catastrophic Wheel Bearing Failure 97alpineM3 3-Series (E21, E30) 13 12-13-2006 12:04 AM
Tire Damage Hogo 3-Series (E46, E90) 2 05-02-2005 02:21 PM
2002 X5 Catastrophic Failure!!! m3isdabomb 1,6,7,8 - Series and Mini Cooper 13 02-17-2005 08:16 PM
Will it damage engine?? olywa 3-Series (E46, E90) 1 08-11-2004 06:35 AM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome