2000 M5 - upset and concerned - BMW Forum - BimmerWerkz.com
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#1 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 11:46 AM
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2000 M5 - upset and concerned

So my M5 wouldn't start yesterday morning. Cranked just fine so battery is ok. Just wouldn't turn over.

So had it towed to the BMW dealer local to my new house (I just moved a week ago)

The BMW service reps calls me and says:

You're at 62,000 miles but it doesn't seem you ever had the 50,000 mile Service II done.

I respond with "I most certainly did, I took it in to my previous dealer at 47,000 miles"

He says, "well. you've got the factory orginal filters, and it's like nothing has ever been maintained on the car."

I respond with "I've had it in to my previous dealer for regular oil changes, checkups and any maintenance that should be done to the car and it's been there often!"

He says, "do you have recepts? cause it would appear it's never been done, ever"

At this point I'm like oh crap. So, I ask him to check everything in the car while it is there. Oh and btw the reason the car won't start is due to a failed fuel pump.

So I call my old dealership and start asking questions....

They tell me that since I brought it in early (at 47,000) they just changed the oil instead of doing Service II (LIKE I ASKED THEM TOO). He said it should have been obvious as they didn't bill me for Service II. At this point I'm like WTF. How am I supposed to KNOW what the bill *should* be for Service II and when I bring the car in for Service II and you tell me "everything looks great" and you just change the oil what am I supposed to think? I'm thinking cool, everthing looks great.

So I call back to the new dealership and he has more news. Air filters are caked and are factory orginal too. O2 censor/filter thingy is orginal. He says it looks as if the car was driving from 0 to 60k miles without a single checkup! So I'm pretty pissed at this point as I took in the car regularly for checkups at my old dealer.

No I am really worried about what I should have checked out. I'm very concerned for the future well being of my car... :-(
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#2 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 05:18 PM
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lawsuit?
you got a 70k dollar car!


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#3 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 05:58 PM
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Holy crap!
WTF has the old dealer been doing? Just oil changes?
I would file a complaint with the BMWNA (www.bmwusa.com). Tell them the situation and maybe they will cover most of the $$$$.

By the way, be polite and I'm sure they'll listen and take care of you. Have your receipts or any paperwork ready.

I have dealt with them in the past and are very reasonable.
PLEASE KEEP US POSTED... This is an interesting post

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#4 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superdeadman
lawsuit?
you got a 70k dollar car!


why the lawsuit?.. the dealer didnt do anything wrong, the customer is supposed to be responsiblefor follwing up every service and transaction made. He should have know that he didnt get billed for the service II becuase it would have been a big bill, and the receipt that the dealership gives you states everything that they did to your car. If anything it was his fault for not following up on the reciepts for the services done. It WILL show on the paper that service II was done.... if it was done, which you should have checked it before leaving the dealer. You should have question them how come they didnt do the service II like you asked.

Now about that dealer you were going to... you should have a word with the service manager, becuase i think he should have been more thorough on your car. What if something was to really go wrong on the mechanical side. I still think its dealer negligence and it should be brought up and dealt with. You should file a complaint, even if it goes nowhere, but it will get somones attention.

One thing.. i thought every filter is replaced with factory oem filters. How would they know if your filters were replaced or not, if its the same exact oem filter that came with your car. If they do like i do, which is i take a paint marker and put the date and miles it was replaced, i do it just becuase i have a habbit of being too anal on things i do to my cars.
Your car should be fine , i wouldnt worry about it. This time request that the service II be performed on the car and thats that. And before you leave check the paperwork showing that they did perform the service II.

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#5 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 06:04 PM
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Try this number and leave a message. State you have a problem and would like to speak to someone. They'll get back to you in the next few days. Again, be polite and they'll listen and hopefully help you.

201-573-7852


So in short, you're the original owner and this "old dealer has been servicing the car for a while, correct? The dealer should have all the maintenance records. You don't have to tell them to do a 30k 50k service. They should know that by heart. I believe there is more to the story but these are my assumptions.
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Last edited by LOS; 07-06-2006 at 06:09 PM.
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#6 (permalink) Old 07-06-2006, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LOS
Try this number and leave a message. State you have a problem and would like to speak to someone. They'll get back to you in the next few days. Again, be polite and they'll listen and hopefully help you.

201-573-7852


So in short, you're the original owner and this "old dealer has been servicing the car for a while, correct? The dealer should have all the maintenance records. You don't have to tell them to do a 30k 50k service. They should know that by heart. I believe there is more to the story but these are my assumptions.
LOS


yes your right there always 2 sides of the story.

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#7 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 08:40 AM
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Quote:
the dealer didnt do anything wrong, the customer is supposed to be responsiblefor follwing up every service and transaction made. He should have know that he didnt get billed for the service II becuase it would have been a big bill, and the receipt that the dealership gives you states everything that they did to your car.
This is my old dealers stance. He is "correct". To a point.

My point (or side) is. As a costumer I don't specifically "know" what service II actually includes. How would some one magically know that while standing at the service desk unless the service person tells you. I looked at the BMWUSA web site and saw that at 50k miles it would be due for Service II. So I went in and said "Service II please".

Here is where there is a bit more to the story and likely where things got messed up at the dealer...... While changing the oil some one tripped or something and spilled a whole bunch of old oil on the car. So they rushed it over to wash it. While it was in their spray wash machine thing a high pressure hose broke free and "wapped" the rear left panel of the car several times putting some significant dings and scratches into the car. The service manager called me practically in tears over what they just did to an M5. The rest of "that" service call was spent with the dealer ship sending the car to a body shop. I remained fairly calm through the whole ordeal but I was of course focused on the body work and making sure it was perfect. The whole "Service II" thing was apparently lost and dropped after the oil change.

Do I necessarily blame the dealer. Yes. They screwed up. Big time. Do I understand how things got screwed up. yes. After the events that transpired I understand. That whole incident didn't cost me a dime. They waved all the charges for the oil change so when I looked at the bill it was $0.00. So my mental process was, I took the car in for Service II and they had an incident and didn't charge me for it.

My luck has been very bad with this dealership. However, every time I deal with them they are very curtious, do their best to make it right and have always fessed up to their mistakes.

I'd feel wrong to lodge an officail complaint on them. It would be unwarrented IMO. At the same time I want to make sure that no long term problems occur with the car after this. My CPO warrentee ends at the end of July and I have the extended warrentee to July of 2008. In 2009 I don't want to start having catastrophic issues that I could solve now under warrentee.

Anyway, how it's turning out. I've spoken with the new dealership and they are fixing quite a bit of stuff under warrentee. Fuel pump included as well. The old dealership is going to pony up for labor on the Service II and I'll just pay for the parts.

After reading so much info on the net about this car, my only concern at this point is cleaning the MAFs. Which I asked the dealer to look into.

Anyway, what would you do? What else should I check, clean, etc?
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#8 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 10:18 AM
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I'm glad things are working out for you. Thank God for the warranty!

How is your cluster? Any pixels missing on the display board?
Have them check the upper control arm bushings and shocks....

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#9 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LOS
I'm glad things are working out for you. Thank God for the warranty!

How is your cluster? Any pixels missing on the display board?
Have them check the upper control arm bushings and shocks....

LOS

They are doing the rear control arm bushings. They say the fronts look fine.

Cluster. on cold days a couple pixels are missing but come on soon as it warms up. On warm days all pixels are good. Does this actually get covered under warrentee?

The bushings aren't covered under warrantee anyway. It's a wearable part, like belts, breaks. Shocks wouldn't be warrantee either, but service says they also look fine.

Car has 62k miles on it. Driven only in summer, mostly on weekends and mostly highway.
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#10 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 12:35 PM
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In your case, it will most likely be covered. The pixel thing is a big issue on our cars. Talk to service advisor and mention the pixel problem. They will go out soon, trust me!
Anyway, tell them you have heard BMWNA has replaced these units free of charge for most customers. In my case, I had to pay half for the part $216 plus labor ($400 total) because my car was 7 yrs old and 78k miles. They did the same thing on my '95 840ci, 101k miles! I can't complain.
Ask him to call BMWNA customer service and find out the details.

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#11 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boostinsixtwintturbo
why the lawsuit?.. the dealer didnt do anything wrong, the customer is supposed to be responsiblefor follwing up every service and transaction made. He should have know that he didnt get billed for the service II becuase it would have been a big bill, and the receipt that the dealership gives you states everything that they did to your car. If anything it was his fault for not following up on the reciepts for the services done. It WILL show on the paper that service II was done.... if it was done, which you should have checked it before leaving the dealer. You should have question them how come they didnt do the service II like you asked.

Now about that dealer you were going to... you should have a word with the service manager, becuase i think he should have been more thorough on your car. What if something was to really go wrong on the mechanical side. I still think its dealer negligence and it should be brought up and dealt with. You should file a complaint, even if it goes nowhere, but it will get somones attention.

One thing.. i thought every filter is replaced with factory oem filters. How would they know if your filters were replaced or not, if its the same exact oem filter that came with your car. If they do like i do, which is i take a paint marker and put the date and miles it was replaced, i do it just becuase i have a habbit of being too anal on things i do to my cars.
Your car should be fine , i wouldnt worry about it. This time request that the service II be performed on the car and thats that. And before you leave check the paperwork showing that they did perform the service II.
Trevize, after that 47,000 mile checkup and attempted Service II I'm sure you took it in for at least 2-3 more oil changes. During these visits they should have realised that there were issues with the car's filters and other things. Additionally, their database should have alerted them of what had and had not been done on your car. So to me they are full of it and although I'm like you in that I don't like to abuse dealerships or people, esp. if they're curtious, this is complete incompetence on their part. You should talk to the dealership owner at the very least and make sure he knows how incompetent they were.
And do file a complaint with BMWNA.
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#12 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trevize
This is my old dealers stance. He is "correct". To a point.

My point (or side) is. As a costumer I don't specifically "know" what service II actually includes. How would some one magically know that while standing at the service desk unless the service person tells you. I looked at the BMWUSA web site and saw that at 50k miles it would be due for Service II. So I went in and said "Service II please".

Here is where there is a bit more to the story and likely where things got messed up at the dealer...... While changing the oil some one tripped or something and spilled a whole bunch of old oil on the car. So they rushed it over to wash it. While it was in their spray wash machine thing a high pressure hose broke free and "wapped" the rear left panel of the car several times putting some significant dings and scratches into the car. The service manager called me practically in tears over what they just did to an M5. The rest of "that" service call was spent with the dealer ship sending the car to a body shop. I remained fairly calm through the whole ordeal but I was of course focused on the body work and making sure it was perfect. The whole "Service II" thing was apparently lost and dropped after the oil change.

Do I necessarily blame the dealer. Yes. They screwed up. Big time. Do I understand how things got screwed up. yes. After the events that transpired I understand. That whole incident didn't cost me a dime. They waved all the charges for the oil change so when I looked at the bill it was $0.00. So my mental process was, I took the car in for Service II and they had an incident and didn't charge me for it.

My luck has been very bad with this dealership. However, every time I deal with them they are very curtious, do their best to make it right and have always fessed up to their mistakes.

I'd feel wrong to lodge an officail complaint on them. It would be unwarrented IMO. At the same time I want to make sure that no long term problems occur with the car after this. My CPO warrentee ends at the end of July and I have the extended warrentee to July of 2008. In 2009 I don't want to start having catastrophic issues that I could solve now under warrentee.

Anyway, how it's turning out. I've spoken with the new dealership and they are fixing quite a bit of stuff under warrentee. Fuel pump included as well. The old dealership is going to pony up for labor on the Service II and I'll just pay for the parts.

After reading so much info on the net about this car, my only concern at this point is cleaning the MAFs. Which I asked the dealer to look into.

Anyway, what would you do? What else should I check, clean, etc?


well in that case i apologize if i seemed to be pointing fingers, i do agree that the dealer did screw up pretty bad, and i would hope they would have done an inspection II for free for the damage cause . But it is dealer incompetance, and i would still have a talk with the service manager, even if you dont file a complaint, let him know that you go there becuase of there service, you can always tell him that you could find another dealer elswhere. Im glad its worked out.
Cheers..

J.

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#13 (permalink) Old 07-07-2006, 07:42 PM
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In the future, I recommend taking your car to a preffered private mechanic. Ask around and see who's good. A good private mechanic will give it to you straight and most often show you the old parts he removes in exchange for the new ones.
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#14 (permalink) Old 07-08-2006, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by scott66
In the future, I recommend taking your car to a preffered private mechanic. Ask around and see who's good. A good private mechanic will give it to you straight and most often show you the old parts he removes in exchange for the new ones.

I just moved into the Boston area. If anybody knows a good one I am seeking.

Got the car back Friday evening. Seems like a whole new car! Man this thing has been choking itself for some time apparently. Even though I haven't really driven the car in over a year cept a few short trips to move it from one garage to another. I'm so happy to have finally moved into our new house and have a garage (a rare find in the city of Boston). The car is going to be driven lots more now that it isn't 70 miles away sitting at our vacation home garage.

The M & M cars are back in the same garage again. Seeing them back together makes me very happy. My wife drives (well owns... I drive it more then she does) an M Roadster. She owned it before we got married. It's how I knew she was right for me :-)
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#15 (permalink) Old 08-29-2006, 11:22 AM
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Gotta be honest....they kept screwing up, but they kept making it up to you? Sure, great service on the tail end of the situation, but if your girlfriend keeps cheating on you and making it up to you everytime you catch her are you going to put up with it? Would you go to a restaurant who gives you terrible service, and apologizes everytime? I'm usually a very understanding guy, to the point of fault sometimes, but if I was in your boat, I'd be royally TO'd. Sounds to me like the service dept. manager is a total airhead. I'd be filing a complaint.

And I agree, definitely find a private mechanic. They're alot better, only difference being unless you find a BMW specialist you'll end up with aftermarket parts on your car probably (although you could probably work that out with the mechanic). My own experience with that recently: just bought a 1997 Infiniti I30 from an individual seller, took it to our private mechanic and everything checked out fine. (Was wrecked and fixed, original owner's hit a deer and decided to buy their rental car while it was being fixed.....hood and headlights only...no radiator or engine bay damage.....we didn't tell our mechanic about this, just to see what he'd find on his own) It drives beautifully and the only things the mechanic brought up were tire balancing and an oil change. We bought the car, and a few days later I take it to the local Infiniti dealer to have the oil changed. When I pay for the oil change they say "Oh by the way, we found a few things that you might want to fix on there while we were doing the oil change." And the guy hands me the invoice with a list of about $2400 worth of repairs that are "not urgent but necessary." Basically, dealers will try to shaft you (not saying this is what happened in your situation, but it's very possible)....whether it be feeding you a load about unecessary repairs, etc. I guess they think most owners don't know enough about their cars. Which is probably true. I probably should've said in response "and you guys make most of your money off your service department." But I just smiled and left.

Yea, not sure that was necessary, but just thought I'd tell you my little story since I'm thinking a bit of that may be happening here (the old dealer feeding you a line here and there). Private mechanics are the way to go.....

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