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#1 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 06:58 PM
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My list of problems ith my 2 month old E60 is long and after three trips back to BMW, they are unresolved. Yesterday, I was left stranded with a "Ignition Fault" warning and the car dead in the water in a middle of traffic. Anyone seen this problem? Had it towed back to BMW and no news from them yet.
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#2 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 07:09 PM
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yes i did, the reason for it is a short cicuited oil level sensor which disables the injector relay and so the car may not start or if luck bad misfire occurs. Check the oil level and if it is correct just disconnect its pluch and the car will starts normally.
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#3 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by grtmoby@Dec 24 2004, 08:09 AM
yes i did, the reason for it is a short cicuited oil level sensor which disables the injector relay and so the car may not start or if luck bad misfire occurs. Check the oil level and if it is correct just disconnect its pluch and the car will starts normally.
[snapback]257271[/snapback]
Thanks - good to know that it could be a simple problem. Car is back with BMW, so I'll confirm when they let me know what when wrong. I can just imagine that I'm doing a 100+ on the highway and the engine cuts off. Scary ..
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#4 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dennisau@Dec 24 2004, 12:58 AM
My list of problems ith my 2 month old E60 is long and after three trips back to BMW, they are unresolved. Yesterday, I was left stranded with a "Ignition Fault" warning and the car dead in the water in a middle of traffic. Anyone seen this problem? Had it towed back to BMW and no news from them yet.
[snapback]257263[/snapback]

The more I read about these E60s, the more I become convinced there are serious issues and complaints about this new model.
A. Problems do NOT seem as isolated incidents. There is a trend.
B. Let us face it; there have been alot of complaints from many owners. What's up with this.
C. Are we going to continue saying: well this is DENNISAU's E60 ONLY!
D. There is no logical justification for what happened to Dennis' E60. He is not the only one either.
E. I am perfectly aware of the fact that all new models carry with them the seeds of recall and the ultimate testing rests with the end users hence bugs, recalls, prefection. I know that much but to get stranded goes well beyond my comprehension.
C. But back in 1997 when I bought my 528I I never ever-along with many of my friends with new/used Bimmers-contemplated the idea of getting stranded in a new Bimmer.
Yes I am very disappointed. THIS IS VERY WRONG. and BMW technicians please take it from here and tell me Dennis is wrong
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#5 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by billB+Dec 24 2004, 02:25 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(billB @ Dec 24 2004, 02:25 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Dennisau@Dec 24 2004, 12:58 AM
My list of problems ith my 2 month old E60 is long and after three trips back to BMW, they are unresolved. Yesterday, I was left stranded with a "Ignition Fault" warning and the car dead in the water in a middle of traffic. Anyone seen this problem? Had it towed back to BMW and no news from them yet.
[snapback]257263[/snapback]

The more I read about these E60s, the more I become convinced there are serious issues and complaints about this new model.
A. Problems do NOT seem as isolated incidents. There is a trend.
B. Let us face it; there have been alot of complaints from many owners. What's up with this.
C. Are we going to continue saying: well this is DENNISAU's E60 ONLY!
D. There is no logical justification for what happened to Dennis' E60. He is not the only one either.
E. I am perfectly aware of the fact that all new models carry with them the seeds of recall and the ultimate testing rests with the end users hence bugs, recalls, prefection. I know that much but to get stranded goes well beyond my comprehension.
C. But back in 1997 when I bought my 528I I never ever-along with many of my friends with new/used Bimmers-contemplated the idea of getting stranded in a new Bimmer.
Yes I am very disappointed. THIS IS VERY WRONG. and BMW technicians please take it from here and tell me Dennis is wrong
[snapback]257285[/snapback]
[/b][/quote]

Hi billB,

I work for as "Troubleshooting & diagnosis Specialist" for BMW and I would agree with you to a certain extent that the E60 has some troubles but let me clarify that this is due to the very high and sophisticated technology in it and software updates is released almost regulary to solve these issues. The mistake that is widely done is that dealers don't update the whole control cunits of the car but just only update the one in doubt. This is totally wrong the car computers have to be updated all at once not just one. simply that all the control units can talk the same language, hope you get what I mean....
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#6 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 08:14 PM
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Dear grtmoby

Probably very view people love Bimmers more than me, I had 86, 325is 5 speed-ya at younger age- ran it to 1/4 of a million from 0 mile other than minor things it was the perfect car...took all my abuses with a sporty spirit.
Got a bit older again went for the 528i back in 1997 still have it no problems till I hit 125.000 mile mark, still minor.

Now On the E60 to tell me (not you but Mr. Chris Bangle at BMW) Dennis and others have to get stranded because of:
A. the sophisticated high tech instruments and computers is REJECTED. Why call it sophisticated if it does not work? Car manufacturers do employ test centers to weed out the bugs in any system; granted it takes 2-3 years to perfect the system.
B. If we going to put the blame on dealers update; don't you think we putting too many eggs in one basket? Customers service? competition? aren't you begging the whole question of reliability? then whats next? customers faith? I can go on and on with this.

To make it short: Imagine if Lockheed Martin, Boeing, AirBus did try to follow your argument saying oh we are so sorry our jet fighter and airplanes are crashing all over the skies due to our new sophisticated equipments! If so someone has to redefine the meaning of sophisticated technology!
regards
billb
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#7 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 08:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by billB@Dec 24 2004, 03:14 AM
Dear grtmoby

Probably very view people love Bimmers more than me, I had 86, 325is 5 speed-ya at younger age- ran it to 1/4 of a million from 0 mile other than minor things it was the perfect car...took all my abuses with a sporty spirit.
Got a bit older again went for the 528i back in 1997 still have it no problems till I hit 125.000 mile mark, still minor.

Now On the E60 to tell me (not you but Mr. Chris Bangle at BMW) Dennis and others have to get stranded because of:
A. the sophisticated high tech instruments and computers is REJECTED. Why call it sophisticated if it does not work? Car manufacturers do employ test centers to weed out the bugs in any system; granted it takes 2-3 years to perfect the system.
B. If we going to put the blame on dealers update; don't you think we putting too many eggs in one basket? Customers service? competition? aren't you begging the whole question of reliability? then whats next? customers faith? I can go on and on with this.

To make it short: Imagine if Lockheed Martin, Boeing, AirBus did try to follow your argument saying oh we are so sorry our jet fighter and airplanes are crashing all over the skies due to our new sophisticated equipments! If so someone has to redefine the meaning of sophisticated technology!
regards
billb
[snapback]257306[/snapback]
Relted to Boeing, AirBus... there equipments are worthing hundreds of millions and the factor of safety in it is unbelievable. Car manufacturers having the same issues and troubles since they started to use fiber optics in the cars (Jaguar, Mercedes...etc all have the same and sometimes more serious troubles). The E60 was tested very careflly prior to release but being driven by various people in various condition can't yield the same as the tests done by the car manufacturer.

About the dealers, it is all their jobs not putting the eggs in one basket as you said it is their job to do the updates correctly and the right way to do it (read my previous post).

btw, how many space shuttle have blown out till now :wink
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#8 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 08:43 PM
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grtmoby: The E60 was tested very careflly prior to release but being driven by various people in various condition can't yield the same as the tests done by the car manufacturer.

Very interesting argument indeed; the only LOGICAL explanation to the above is probably the MPG calculations. But we still have problems which transcends testing under IDEAL/PERFECT conditions; don't we? Solution? based on the above and since the E60 had a comprehensive test as you said; the solution is either to get all BMW owners drive under one condition or make different BMWs for each condition. i.e one for me to drive in NJ conditions and a different Bimmer for Billy the kid in El-Paso. As you can see I am resting my case.....Sorry I am running out of options here!
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#9 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 08:55 PM
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Hey billB,

do u think all of us drive the same way and in same places where radio signals and frequencies are identical or even close. Trust me, when you work in it and diagnose the coming problems you sometimes don't believe the results you get.

do u know owners of the new Jaguar XJ Series or Mercedes S-Class, ask them about their isues and tell me (I know the answer).......


FYI, I worked for Jaguar, Rolls Royce and Ferrari before getting to BMW if this would mean anything...
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#10 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 11:31 PM
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Originally posted by Dennisau+Dec 24 2004, 08:17 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dennisau @ Dec 24 2004, 08:17 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-grtmoby@Dec 24 2004, 08:09 AM
yes i did, the reason for it is a short cicuited oil level sensor which disables the injector relay and so the car may not start or if luck bad misfire occurs. Check the oil level and if it is correct just disconnect its pluch and the car will starts normally.
[snapback]257271[/snapback]
Thanks - good to know that it could be a simple problem. Car is back with BMW, so I'll confirm when they let me know what when wrong. I can just imagine that I'm doing a 100+ on the highway and the engine cuts off. Scary ..
[snapback]257279[/snapback]
[/b][/quote]

BMW confirmed that it was the sensor for the oil level which was faulty. Looks like there is a quality challenge at BMW with this sensor. Perhaps a recall is to check all vehicles is required.
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#11 (permalink) Old 12-23-2004, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by grtmoby@Dec 24 2004, 02:55 AM
Hey billB,

do u think all of us drive the same way and in same places where radio signals and frequencies are identical or even close. Trust me, when you work in it and diagnose the coming problems you sometimes don't believe the results you get.

do u know owners of the new Jaguar XJ Series or Mercedes S-Class, ask them about their isues and tell me (I know the answer).......


FYI, I worked for Jaguar, Rolls Royce and Ferrari before getting to BMW if this would mean anything...
[snapback]257319[/snapback]
HEY grtmoby read this:

In July, Ford reported that its Premier Automotive Group, which includes Jaguar, Aston Martin, Volvo and Land Rover, had a pretax loss of $362 million for the second quarter on sales of $6.9 billion, compared with a pretax profit of $166 million on sales of $6.4 billion for the second quarter of 2003.

The E-Class also posted a new record, with sales of over 305,000 passenger cars. In 2003, the sedan consolidated its leading position in the upper-range segment (market share in 2003: 36 percent) by boosting unit sales 42 percent to 253,700 passenger cars.

American motorists’ passion for BMW’s “ultimate driving machines” burns brighter than ever, despite temptations from new luxury rivals and bold styling that has turned off some purists.

No comments....#s speak for themselves and the red is scary!
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