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3-Series (E36) Chat relating to the BMW 3-Series from 1992-1999. Autodoodad Specific models include: BMW 316i, BMW 318i, BMW 318iS/ti, BMW 320, BMW 323, BMW 320, BMW 324, BMW 325, BMW 328.

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Old 12-23-2004, 01:47 PM   #1 (permalink)
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I notice alot of forum members go straight for under-the-hood mods (chips, air filters, fly wheels, etc..) and flirt with exhaust re-fitment schemes in order to increase performance (handling and speed)....

But today I just got brand new all season 225/50/ZR16 Khumo ECSTA ASX tires to replace my summer high performance 225/50/ZR16 Michelin pilot MXM HX sport tires which replaced 15 inch touring season Toyos on the original BMW stock 15 inch steel wheel and BMW stock hub cap last july.

Well my point is I noticed a stunning increase in aceleration and improvement in handling each time I upgraded my tires! I'm very impressed!

I don't know why most of people with E36 cars I see driving around here in NYC still have the original 15 inch stock caps and bottle cap alloys on their car with crappy ass continental touring tires...

This was my first upgrade and I think we E36 drivers should put this on top of our list when we set out to mod our cars.....

In fact if you are on this forum and still have the original BMW 15 inch stock steel wheel or15 inch alloys on your E36 leave now and don't come back til you get 16 and higher alloys with Z rated performace tires!!!!

I'm joking of course...but tires are a serious mod that should not be overlooked....anymore!
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Old 12-23-2004, 01:54 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I agree...when it comes down to it, tires are what ultimately get the power of your car's engine, onto the road. It is a very necessary tool for performance. Just getting rid of those damn rims can be expensive. But yes, a stiffer walled tire, that is still rather soft will provide the excellent grip, but allow for superb handling.
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Old 12-23-2004, 01:55 PM   #3 (permalink)
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yeah, ok, whatever
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Old 12-23-2004, 01:57 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Very true... basic stuff can sometimes be the best mod. I've always felt that if you start on the outside of a certain mechanical system.. and work in is the best way... for example... suspension... start with the tyres... then the bushings.. then the actual parts... this theory doesnt work for everything.. but it does work for most..

Good Point on tyres... Kumho makes good stuff.. I like the MXs... either way.. they make good stuff...

Good Point and good post,

Les
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Old 12-23-2004, 01:59 PM   #5 (permalink)
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couldn't agree with you any more... my mechanic when I first met him the first thing he asked me was what kind of tires do you have on. since then I've upgraded greatly. tires are needed to grip up and go. if you have all the power in the world, it won't do a damn good on a track if your car won't grip.
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Old 12-23-2004, 02:12 PM   #6 (permalink)
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i COMPLETELY agree. Good tires are essential! They should be the first suspension upgrade done to any car. I love my Yoko AVS sports on 18's. I think i'm gonna try the S-03s next or the Pirelli PZero Nero M&S
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Old 12-23-2004, 04:38 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I completely agree with what's been said about good tires. They make a world of difference.

However I'd like to hear the reasoning about why the 15" wheels are bad.
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Old 12-23-2004, 08:45 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by Delmarco@Dec 23 2004, 03:47 PM
Well my point is I noticed a stunning increase in aceleration
[snapback]257131[/snapback]
Really, now if I get new tires again, I'll accelerate faster?

No.
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Old 12-23-2004, 10:12 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Yes it is possible. If the tires/wheels are lighter but grip better, you could notice a difference in acceleration...
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Old 12-23-2004, 10:54 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I'm with Kevin ... i was all for this topic and agreed wholeheartedly with the tire theology ... but stock 15's aren't all that bad. A decent looking, lightweight rim wrapped in matching new performance rubber is a decent chunk of change. And being 17 ... not to mention having expensive taste ... affording a new set of rims/tires is a stretch. Especially as i look at the figures for my upcoming 5 years of college education. Suddenly, seeing "$40,000 a year" above my head makes things like rims much smaller

(and THAT my friend, is why people look to spend $200 on a chip first before looking to spend between 1-2 grand on rims ...)

i love my Khumo ASX's as well ... my car noticibly handled much better after i replaced the beated, over-sized set 205/65/15 MMX's ...

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Old 12-24-2004, 12:03 AM   #11 (permalink)
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ajames is right, Im 16 and have no way to afford anything better than the 15" alloys and the Pirelli P600 tires that i got my car with. New rims would greatly improve the look of the car (never liked the 10 spoke) and new tires would give me some decent grip but I cant spend $5000+ dollars on wheels when i still need to convert my car to a 5 speed.
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Old 12-24-2004, 12:39 AM   #12 (permalink)
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well said!! i'm with u on that
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Old 12-24-2004, 05:58 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally posted by ajames@Dec 24 2004, 05:54 AM
I'm with Kevin ... i was all for this topic and agreed wholeheartedly with the tire theology ... but stock 15's aren't all that bad. A decent looking, lightweight rim wrapped in matching new performance rubber is a decent chunk of change. And being 17 ... not to mention having expensive taste ... affording a new set of rims/tires is a stretch. Especially as i look at the figures for my upcoming 5 years of college education. Suddenly, seeing "$40,000 a year" above my head makes things like rims much smaller

(and THAT my friend, is why people look to spend $200 on a chip first before looking to spend between 1-2 grand on rims ...)

i love my Khumo ASX's as well ... my car noticibly handled much better after i replaced the beated, over-sized set 205/65/15 MMX's ...

alex
[snapback]257472[/snapback]

I'm in agreement regards the Rims string but I also agree with the point that you can get better performance by buying better tyres for the rims you have.

I've got 245/17s (on the back) and recently replaced the cheap crap that the previous owner had on them with descent rubber. They are so much better. Before I did the Traction Control cut or the back-end slide-out all the time, now I can accelerate and corner much harder.

Most of all, I just can't believe how much it costs you for new rims....... I can buy a new set of BBS 225/17 with half descent Avons for 599.00. Do new tyre/rims really cost that much in the US?
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Old 12-24-2004, 09:07 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally posted by Kevin325i@Dec 23 2004, 02:38 PM
I completely agree with what's been said about good tires. They make a world of difference.

However I'd like to hear the reasoning about why the 15" wheels are bad.
[snapback]257228[/snapback]
15" wheels aren't "bad" BMW picked them because they provide a lot of comfort and decent stabilty for an affordable price. Its true they don't provide the "bling" as most drivers these days want, but they do serve the purpose of comfort and affordability. Having a bigger, wider wheel with low profile tires causes much more vibration and are not as comfortable. Not to mention they are much more expensive. It is my assumption that most car manufacturers have succumb to the demands of the consumer wanting more asthetically pleasing wheels, but utilize better suspension components avoiding a reduction in comfort.
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Old 12-24-2004, 03:39 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I'm well aware of why the factory put them on the car, I want to know why larger wheels equals more performance in everyone's eyes here.

If anything smaller wheels equals better performance. The only thing you get with larger wheels is the visual appearance.

Yes, you can buy 17" wheels that are 1 or 2 lbs lighter, but you can also buy 15" that will be up to 10 lbs lighter than the stock.

Wider tires are ussually another benefit of going larger, but you can easily fit a 225 on a 7" wide wheel. Or you could buy a 15x7.5" wheel and fit 235s .

Oh and don't forget the "lower profile sidewall" that everyone seems to care so much about. Get a lower profile 15", there aren't many options and your speedometer will be off, but you'll also gain the added benefit of better acceleration.

A 215/50/15 will give you around a 3 mph error at 60 mph, but that's assuming you've got a perfect speedometer. That tire size is also like adding a 3.30 rear end to your car.
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