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3-Series (E36) Chat relating to the BMW 3-Series from 1992-1999. Autodoodad Specific models include: BMW 316i, BMW 318i, BMW 318iS/ti, BMW 320, BMW 323, BMW 320, BMW 324, BMW 325, BMW 328.

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#1 (permalink) Old 05-19-2005, 11:11 PM
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I know that i dont have anti-lock brakes on my car because the other day i was in a gravel drive way and slamed on my brakes and i just slid. Do any of the E36s come with anti-lock brakes?
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#2 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 01:21 AM
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um. anti lock brakes don't work too well in gravel. there on but they can't get traction either way so you slide anyway ( i rolled my landrover with anti lock brakes off a ciff cuz it slid with abs) do a hard brake check on a clear road. and it'll tell you if you have abs. You should

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#3 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 02:50 AM
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your car should have abs brakes. if it doenst work than it must be disabled somehow

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#4 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Steinkek@May 19 2005, 10:11 PM
I know that i dont have anti-lock brakes on my car because the other day i was in a gravel drive way and slamed on my brakes and i just slid. Do any of the E36s come with anti-lock brakes?
[snapback]346267[/snapback]
When you turn on the ignition, look closely on the cluster, do you see the ABS light doing a self-test (i.e., turning on for a second or two and then turning off by iteself) ? If you see the ABS light turning on and off during the startup, ABS is fine. Like others have suggested, drive in a parking lot and brake hard; if the ABS is working you will fee it by the brake pedal.

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#5 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 12:23 PM
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You should also hear it - a low thrumming noise.


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#6 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by LivinFast67@May 20 2005, 07:21 AM
um. anti lock brakes don't work too well in gravel. there on but they can't get traction either way so you slide anyway ( i rolled my landrover with anti lock brakes off a ciff cuz it slid with abs) do a hard brake check on a clear road. and it'll tell you if you have abs. You should
[snapback]346292[/snapback]
Then they shouldn't work in the wet or on snow either :P
And that is when you really need it!

Mine works on ice.

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#7 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 03:14 PM
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Actually, ABS is horrible on gravel, however, great in the wet, snow and ice. Here is why. The only way to stop quickly in gravel is to lock the wheels up. It then creates a wall of gravel infront of the car and digs down to whatever is underneath the gravel. If you will notice, off road vehicles do not have ABS. With ABS the car stops over a much longer distance, because the car keeps releasing the brakes because the wheels lock up. So if you ever plan on off roading, get rid of ABS.
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#8 (permalink) Old 05-20-2005, 09:53 PM
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Didn't think about that loose gravel, gravel roads aren't really loose here most of the time. Sorry.

But the point of ABS isn't to cut the stopping distance, it's there for you to be able to control/steer the car during hard braking.

Racing (road course) cars don't use ABS either.

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#9 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 12:00 AM
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the point of abs is to stop the car quicker!!!! and also to give u more control. The theory about gravel makes sense yeah but shouldnt the same theory apply to snow then too, when u break you would build a wall of snow infront of you which will make you stop quicker too as it will be harder for the car to slide further forward!? thts just me thinking logically though, dunno if im right or not but abs do stop you quicker. racing cars don't need it as they dont exactly need to skid to a full stop as fast as they can!?

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#10 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by WarNox@May 20 2005, 11:00 PM
the point of abs is to stop the car quicker!!!! and also to give u more control. The theory about gravel makes sense yeah but shouldnt the same theory apply to snow then too, when u break you would build a wall of snow infront of you which will make you stop quicker too as it will be harder for the car to slide further forward!? thts just me thinking logically though, dunno if im right or not but abs do stop you quicker. racing cars don't need it as they dont exactly need to skid to a full stop as fast as they can!?
[snapback]346573[/snapback]
At first thought, yes. The properties of snow (water) and gravel (rock, usually limestone of some sort or granite or some kind of mixture). Consider that snow when compressed becomes ice, also compression causes heat, which will melt snow and form water. If you compress snow quickly enough, that means you'll get ice covered water in front of your tires. Compressing rock will melt it, yes, heating rock will melt it yes, but at MUCH higher compression rates and heating rates (obviously).
Now, a lump of bumpy rock will stop your car much faster than a lump of water covered ice.
Just to let you know from the science viewpoint.
You know, just from me and redline's argument, I'm going to appoint myself head of scientific reasoning on this board. Heh.


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#11 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 12:06 PM
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Originally posted by WarNox@May 21 2005, 06:00 AM
the point of abs is to stop the car quicker!!!!
[snapback]346573[/snapback]
Think about that, the physics behind it, and explain it.

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#12 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ILiveToRide+May 21 2005, 10:06 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ILiveToRide @ May 21 2005, 10:06 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-WarNox@May 21 2005, 06:00 AM
the point of abs is to stop the car quicker!!!!
[snapback]346573[/snapback]
Think about that, the physics behind it, and explain it.
[snapback]346660[/snapback]
[/b][/quote]
The point of ABS is to stop the car quicker with the brake fully deppressed. Considering the skill of most drivers on the road. If something jumps out infront of thier car like a person, dog, cat or light pole, they will slam on the brakes whether it is dry or pouring down rain. People panic when their car doesn't stop and press down on the brake more. Only experianced drivers will modulate the brake pedal in a car without ABS. Thereby ABS stops the car quicker for an inexperainced or typical driver quicker. However, a skilled driver without ABS will be able to stop the car quicker everytime, because the driver will be able to use maxium braking force for the conditions that the driver is in. So for an experianced driver ABS doesn't evn play into the equation because the experianced driver would never let it activate by over braking for the conditions that he is in.
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#13 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 04:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by thekid+May 21 2005, 07:47 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(thekid @ May 21 2005, 07:47 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'>
Quote:
Originally posted by ILiveToRide@May 21 2005, 10:06 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-WarNox
Quote:
@May 21 2005, 06:00 AM
the point of abs is to stop the car quicker!!!!
[snapback]346573[/snapback]


Think about that, the physics behind it, and explain it.
[snapback]346660[/snapback]
The point of ABS is to stop the car quicker with the brake fully deppressed. Considering the skill of most drivers on the road. If something jumps out infront of thier car like a person, dog, cat or light pole, they will slam on the brakes whether it is dry or pouring down rain. People panic when their car doesn't stop and press down on the brake more. Only experianced drivers will modulate the brake pedal in a car without ABS. Thereby ABS stops the car quicker for an inexperainced or typical driver quicker. However, a skilled driver without ABS will be able to stop the car quicker everytime, because the driver will be able to use maxium braking force for the conditions that the driver is in. So for an experianced driver ABS doesn't evn play into the equation because the experianced driver would never let it activate by over braking for the conditions that he is in.
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[/b][/quote]

That is basically what I said earlier, even though I didn't put into that many words.
And I stand by that the reason ABS was developed was so that you could correct/avoid the slide you'd (usually) get under hard braking when trying to avoid an object. Especially when you panic and slam the brakes, but still try to steer.

But this is like arguing which came first, the hen or the egg?

Not sure I think you're entirely right about that last bit.

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#14 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 05:43 PM
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About the experianced driver? Then how come race cars do not have ABS? Once you get the feel for the car the ABS should never kick in. The ABS in my car has kicked in once. It only kicked in because I was being stupid and trying to make a buddy who was beating me in a race miss a turn so he would have to go down and find a place to turn around. But any way, experianced drivers do not need ABS for anything. Period.
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#15 (permalink) Old 05-21-2005, 06:04 PM
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ABS is made to keep the wheels from locking up because if the wheels are locked up, you can't steer the car/truck/whatever. They don't stop the car faster in the dry, sometimes though in the wet they will. The point is that you can hit the brakes hard with ABS and still turn the car to swerve out of the way.


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